Data Mining

My excuse for the late blog post this week (and last) Not that I’ve gotten past page 25, but so far a good read, espcecially for a government document. It’s been three days since I wrote that last sentence, so I’m going to publish today, finished or not.


When I started teaching, 15 years ago, No Child Left Behind, NCLB, was not a thing. Common Core was not a thing, I don’t think most states even had standards. Fifteen years later and NCLB is over, replaced with Every Child Succeeds, but the damage perhaps has been done.


Most educators I know have been pretty negative on the whole NLCB thing. As for me, I thought it was a joke from the beginning. Who would ever expect 100% achievement? Haven’t you ever heard of SPED, ELL, ED, children? Not to mention the obvious inequities in buildings or supports not controlled by schools. I mean really 100%, not going to happen, ever! What I did like was the conversation on accountability. I would like to think we could have started that conversation without threatening to destroy public education, but maybe not.


The core problem, as I see it, is that accountability has never been defined in a way that actually improves education. I think teachers need to be accountable to parents, after all it’s their children we are educating. When asked most parents will usually say something to the effect of, my school is good, it’s those other schools that suck. Those few parents who will look at their own school and say this school sucks will usually say, but here are good teachers in the school. Finally, everyone, even the pope, will agree good schools, and teachers in particular, are underfunded, yet try to get a local school referendum to pass in the US. Why is it we demand accountability without furnishing the tools to succeed?


Anyway my point is not to whine about the state of our educational system in the United States it could be better but it will not change because I wrote a blog post. What I would really like to talk about today is data.

What is data?

This whole NCLB thing heralded a new emphasis on data. We can’t trust principals, those experts of teaching so named because they are the principal teacher in a school. We can’t trust parents, because they are intimidated by the degree carrying hooligans. And we certainly can’t trust those unions, they are the cause of all this trouble. We have to use hard fast, data real numbers that don’t lie. (Please don’t quote Mark Twain and statistics right now).


I think education can be improved with the use of data but we’re not having a conversation on how to create and mine that data. What we’re trying to do is collect a ton of data on everything without getting too deep into the question of what makes quality data.


Evidently, if data is to tell the truth it must be a number and that number must be pulled from so sort of test. If we want to know anything about education, we should ignore quotes attributed to Confucius. In this manner everything that is done in education must be subject to some sort of double blind or A B test. If we are to intervene with students that intervention must have been researched and found acceptable. And when we are not using an approved and researched curriculum (and sometimes when we are), we should be also be performing our own research.

How do we find good data for our classroom?

Teachers are often being asked to write and or use a common formative assessments and then use that data to inform education. We are then to compare our results from a common assessment with the results of the teacher down the hall. If they are doing a better job we should consider teaching in the same manner (because it couldn’t have anything to do with the students or anything like that). Like the PARCC test but on a smaller scale.


Some questions I have on this whole thing. Does a multiple choice test with a hundred questions give me good data? Can a three question exit slip give me good data? Can a common formative assessment really lead to quality data? What is authentic assessment? Will authentic data in my classroom be the same as authentic data in the classroom next door? If a student can explain how to solve a problem, but can’t do that on paper, has s/he mastered the standard? If data is so important why isn’t psychometrics a class in teacher education? Why don’t we have a psychometrician in each school or at least each district?


Good classroom data won’t come from some administrative committee outside of the classroom creating assessments. Creating formative assessments has to be done by the teachers who are teaching that subject. Not teachers of the subject, but teachers actually teaching right now. Some sort of common summative assessment might be a different beast. Do teachers have discussions on what constitutes a quality question that provides quality data? Do they have that kind of time? How do we standardize the data collection from authentic assessments? If I use problem based learning and she uses direct instruction can we collect the same data? Can we compare data?

Teacher education

Are teachers taught how to create a vehicle for collecting quality data? Why do we always seem to default to a test? Do we know what makes a good question? When learning to teach we study child development. We have an idea of how a students in our age range will generally behave, and act. We learn pretty quick about the neighborhood in which we teach. What resources will a student have at home. How much support they will get when doing homework. That sort of thing, but how does that translate into data? More importantly how does that translate into data we can use in the classroom to inform instruction?


I haven’t been in a teacher education program for a long time. When I was there we had a couple of classes on data collection and action research, but I don’t remember a big emphasis on quality data collection methods in the classroom, just action research for our own purposes. It was a graduate program so our data collection methods were concentrated on data we would use for our thesis paper. How similar or different should that be to data collection in our classroom. Right now I have to say the data collection we do for state and federal levels isn’t really all that high quality.


I’m not even talking testing scandals in Washington D.C. or Atlanta. I’m just talking about quality data, the basics. Sure we are testing 90+% of the kids, but are the kids actually putting in an effort. Obviously not, because  a lot of schools have these big expensive pep rally, assemblies, reward parties, motivate students to put effort into the test. Quite honestly, I think, we would be better off using real world modeling to choose a motivated representative sample of the population and use that to determine if education is working. The only problem is that we couldn’t do representative sampling for individual teachers, or even schools. Of course the data we use now is suspect for individual teachers and most schools as well, but it seems we aren’t willing to admit that just yet.

Data and learning

What do we do with the data? Brain based education is popular now. Teachers, at least some, are designing lessons based on engaging the whole child. No more drill and kill until education is beat into a child, instead we create multifaceted lessons designed to create an entry point for each child and all of them lead to the same end. In the classroom teachers should formatively assess students and use that information to change instruction for the better.  Subject teams create common formative assessments to see if one teacher is teaching better than another. Buildings should compare those common formative assessments within a district. So on and so forth until we know how to best educate each and every child in the best way.


Well that’s the dream. the reality is depending on the school, or even the classroom, I might spend the majority of my time keeping order, or reteaching, or back filling knowledge, or feeding the hungry, or sharing emotions. Data collection can easily get lost. I forget, I compromise, the well crafted assessment is scrapped for an interesting rabbit hole.


My point is this, we don’t talk enough about what it means to collect quality data in the classroom. We don’t talk enough about where and how it informs instruction. It’s there and some teachers are really good at it (not me), but that isn’t what I mean. I mean that is not the central focus of teacher education, but it seems to be the central focus of evaluation. So which one will change?  


My Week in Tech Integration – Formative Assessment

Classroom Action

Several teachers have been using during RTI. A great way to get that math practice in while working with a small group.

All of these researched based help usually say something like students who put in 75 minutes a day have shown improvement in math. Well if you practice 75 minutes a day on math of course you are going to get better. That isn’t to say the program is not useful, just that it is not trans-formative. It is a tried and true practice with just a bit of an edge because the work adapts to the level of the student instantaneously.


There are of course many similar programs out there, depending on what you want at a teacher could determine the tool you use. However, all should have at least some way to sign in and track the students, so that we know if they are actually learning or not.


Put your favorite tool in the comments or go to this survey and put it there. Some of my favorites are:


Presentations to students – getting interactive

Wouldn’t it be nice to integrate formative assessment into your regular teaching? I know it’s easy a quick half sheet of paper and boom an exit slip. But then you have to grade everything and what if they didn’t understand the first thing you said and so were lost for the entire class period.

Some folks will create a quick Google form (like the one above, you can add videos as well) then use something like flubaroo to automatically grade it. The problem is that is still separating the discussion from the assessment.


Enter the web app Blendspace. It is a product one of the elementary teachers showed me Wednesday. It is a very simple way to add content and make quick multiple choice quizzes. Students don’t need an email to sign up so it is appropriate for the elementary crowd.


However, the questions are limited to multiple choice and sometimes you want students to be able to write or draw and answer. So here is a list of a few similar tools. Nearpod, PearDeck, Socrative, SmartBoard clickers, Classflow, and Junoed.


Of course the middle school teachers noticed the educreations app. Similar to the Show Me app and the Doceri app (more of a presentation tool). All of these are iPad apps which require an iPad and a way to get the iPad onto your projector, which can be done with Air Server.


Stuff from the web

Portfolio defense to graduate high school

From Envision academy charter schools.

Cool blog I found two great posts.


Most people will like and probably use the first one right away, but the second one is great for technology. When you start asking “How do I create curriculum with multiple ways to learn the same content?” My mind goes immediately to technology. I might share one way to learn content in class and then offer a couple of youtube videos on my web site for further help. So when students don’t quite get what I explained in class they don’t have to rewatch my same lecture a million times and hope it finally sinks in, they can watch alternative explanations and hopefully one of those sticks.


Cool kindergarten classroom

My Week in Tech Integration 3/6/2015

I spent a lot of time in extracurricular classrooms this week, one teacher spent the first 5 or 10 minutes of class just asking students about what they were doing what they accomplished in other classes and clubs. Obviously she did it a lot because they were ready and willing to share and some of the comments were updates from previous weeks. When they got to work though it was all business.

Posture was mentioned a couple of times lately. I love how some of the elementary classrooms have big rubber bands under some desks so kids aren’t constantly tapping their feet. And last week at the ICE conference a participant brought up the Alexander Technique for Musicians and how slouching actually takes more energy than sitting up straight.

I read The History of Future of Education from Audrey Watters

My thought for the day. What is the difference between an overhead projector and an SMARTboard?

I used to used in my classroom and I know a few teachers at the high school also use it. It is a great tool for communication with students and parents. We know it’s working when students are complaining that some teachers use it too much. If you have students who are constantly missing assignments being able to send a group text to students and their parents without sharing phone numbers is awesome. Plus you can schedule texts for an optimum time. I always sent mine around dinner time.

Do you know about the Camscanner app? Some teachers like everything to be electronic so they can annotate and keep a copy in their google drive or Haiku dropbox. Some students prefer to write by hand. Camscanner allows you to take a picture of a piece of paper and turn it into a PDF and upload it to your Google Drive. Now that the first draft is written and feedback given the second draft can be typed.

I’ve been showing off Learning Management Systems to the middle school teachers. No one has said it is required, but I have always thought it was an invaluable tool for putting responsibility for learning onto the shoulders of the students. And as we are almost one to one in the middle school I would almost consider it necessary.

The power of a LMS in the classroom is not for the low students, or for the recalcitrant students, it is for the smartest and hardest working students. The student who takes decent notes, does all assignments, and has decent grades. The student who could be moving faster and works independently, but waits patiently for the entire class. This isn’t even a gifted student, just an average student with a good work ethic.

When this type of student is given an LMS they can work at their own pace, usually slightly faster than average, and still take time to explore topics of greater interest. When they get stuck they won’t be so far ahead that they are stuck alone and have to wait weeks for the rest of the class to catch up. Maybe even a regular conference with the teacher will be all they need, because certainly they won’t spend months working alone, maybe just one unit they are more independent than another. At any rate the teacher is checking progress reports and formative assignments regularly so they know what the student is doing and how well they are progressing.

Meanwhile the teacher still teaches class as normal, but has time to work with smaller groups of students. They in turn move faster because they have more teacher time and more individual instruction.

How does it work?

Students who show evidence of independent learning can do more in the classroom on their own leaving the teacher more time to work with students who are not as independent. Formative assessments like self grading practice quizzes or video quizzes with educannon or EdTed can be assigned for homework, or as bell ringers. This quick formative assessment shows they have a strong grasp of the concept and then can choose to do some independent or small group work in the classroom. While the teacher can spend more time with other students. It becomes possible for students to move at their own pace and/or get more in depth learning on a concept without extreme burden on the teacher.

An LMS can help with that recalcitrant student also. If your content is online it removes the excuse of “I was absent” or “I missed that lesson”. If the homework is online students can never forget it. If the discussion is online (at least partially) everyone can participate. If parents have accounts they can always stay up to date with what is happening in class. If alternative content (youtube, Kahn Academy, LearnZillion, Alex, etc…) is made available students can choose to learn in the way most suitable to them. Shared notes and other resources can be attached to each unit. It isn’t possible to make a horse drink, but we can take away excuses.

Finally, an LMS is great for the future. Digital projects and portfolios can be linked to students and brought with them to high school. The classroom walls are in effect removed. Students can learn when they are most comfortable learning, they can come back and revisit (ok they won’t), they can, well it’s a tool it won’t create utopia in your classroom, but it can help.

We looked at four learning management systems. they are:

HaikuLearning is great and several teachers use the free version. Some teachers even ask why we all aren’t using it.

Google Classroom is free. To be honest it isn’t a classroom. It is more like a place to assign and collect work. It syncs great with Google Drive (obviously) and can be used in conjunction with another LMS just for assignments.

Schoology is kind of like the facebook interface. It has it’s own calendar. you can create courses and groups, send messages, and add resources. The app center allows you to bring in web 2.0 functionality into your classroom. Like Backchannel Chat, or TurnItIn. There may be an extra cost for some apps.

Edomodo is very similar to Schoology. It is free and you can add apps, many of which are extra. You can also easily create quizzes and add resources. It also possible to connect to google Drive.


Ask the Right Questions

When bringing technology into the classroom, how do you know you’re asking the wrong questions?


Can you help me find an app that will teach …?

What kind of tech should I have in my classroom?

How do I use this in my classroom?

Can you show me how to use this?

How do I find time for this?

How do I fit this into my lesson?


When your questions have to do with bringing something extra or replacing expert knowledge of teaching.


Instead ask:

What do I want my student to learn?

What ways to I want to present the content?

How will students prove they have gained understanding?

How will I give feedback to my students?

How will students make corrections and resubmit? (iterate)



CCSS doesn’t leave time for this.

I have so much more content to cover.

The kids are/will be off task.

Students just know how to play, not learn.

Texting, slang, etc… is not real speaking writing.

The technology/wifi/site doesn’t always work.

Students wont get enough practice.

They cheat on tests/quizzes.

I don’t know how to do it. I don’t have time to learn.

What is the biggest lesson you have learned in the corporate world?

Answer by A Quora admin:

My past – 30 years in corporate life.  Was an executive, and then thrown off the corporate ladder 7 years ago, and it's been a slow climb back up since.

What have I learned?

1. Whatever you do, be competent in your current job.  It's the only true currency you have.  That being said, no amount of competence will protect you when the next re-organization comes.

2. Never forget that relationships in business should be business relationships.  You may have a friend or lover at work, but the relationship will end the moment the opportunity to advance in the business is placed between you and your friend or lover.  By the way, I strongly recommend keeping romance outside of the workplace.

3. Understand that politics is a fact of corporate life, and learn to deal with it.  That means you take time to understand the views of the people involved in corporate conflicts, as well as the conflicts themselves.  There will be times when you have to choose between being in the right or being employed.  It's your choice.

4. Understand the culture of the organization, especially their expectations of what makes a good employee.  They all say they believe in teamwork, dedication, hard work, etc.  But look at the employees who are successful, who get the recognition, who rise quickly – they represent what the company is looking for.  What do they do that you can do?

5. Everything communicates.  How you dress, how you stand, how you speak, etc.  If you want to succeed in a corporate environment, you have to communicate that you are the kind of employee that represents the corporate success story.

6. It's a mistake to confuse your personal identity with your employment.  If and when you're sacked, you'll be spending quite a bit of time trying to figure out who you are.   Have a life outside a corporate life.

7. Document what you do in a public place.  We maintain a wiki where I work, and I make a point of adding things I've learned.  I do it not only to remember how to do things, but also so that everyone can see what I do, and how much I do.  Because I've made a habit of it, it's not regarded as a "cover your ass" (CYA) activity, but a cynical person might see it that way.

8. Make your boss look good.  Understand what your boss regards as a priority, and help him or her accomplish it.  Make sure that you document what you've done.  Your boss needs the accomplishment, but shouldn't get the credit for the work you've done.

9. Train your replacement.  You won't be able to get a promotion if there's no one else to take your job.

10. For all of the reputation that corporations are soul-sucking, back stabbing, political jungles where you can only rise by stepping on the heads of others, they also provide employment, benefits and a bit of security that support millions of people and their families world wide.

They are not democracies, not charities, and not therapy centers.  They exist to make money, and they hired you to help them make money.  That's the deal.

Keep that in mind every day, keep your emotions in check, do your job, and if you find you don't like working there anymore, don't complain – just keep it professional, and move on.

What is the biggest lesson you have learned in the corporate world?

Wish List

Ok this is just too cute. My kid is home sick today so he put together his Christmas wish list. Complete with links.
* X-Box 1
* Minecraft X-Box 1
* ASRock AM1B-M Micro ATX AM1 Motherboard
* Asus Radeon R7 250 1GB Video Card
* Microsoft Windows 8.1 (32/64-bit)
* Acer V206HQLAbd 60Hz 19.5″ Monitor
* AKG K518LERED Headphones
*X-BOX Controller x2


PC Parts link:


I find myself spending a lot of time on imgur. It fascinates me how much of the new language of young people is changing from words to pictures.

The world is a changing at a fast pace and our language needs to keep up with the language of images.

Where once upon a time, the only time when the average person cared about or used citations was in an English paper for school, we are now starting to see them pop up all over the place.

It is not terribly uncommon to find someone asking for a citation in a Facebook argument. It is even more common to see someone cite a debunking of a meme, on Facebook or G+ or any social media. That isn’t to say we have a lot of well educated populous politically. There are still a lot of people who will believe almost anything. There are also a lot of websites who are more than happy to create their own semi-legitimate proof of their own half-truths.

With the rise in the use of citing a source to prove a point, and the more visual aspects of the Internet, (imgur)we are actually seeing a change in the method of citation. In an English paper teachers still expect to use the traditional form of citations, APA, MLA, or Chicago style. On the other hand, on social Media and blog posts we more often see the hyperlink to another article as opposed to a bibliography at the end of the post.

Getting even more popular is the infographic, Pictochart,  This will usually have a couple of citations written in small print at the bottom, but the modern writer still prefers inline citations, like hyperlinks. So the next invention that I have been seeing is the Thinglink.

Similar to a infographic the Thinklink can insert a pop-up for more information. Most of the time this is used to give someone more information, but I love the idea this author uses. He uses Thinklink to add citations to his writing.

So, the question is, “Is our education system keeping up with the changes?”


A comment on this blog post just seems to say to me that being within the Zone of Proximal Development (ZPD) is a motivating factor in education.  It isn’t, it’s a scaffolding tool. The ZPD is basically that sweet spot where a question is just hard enough to make a student think, but not hard enough that they cannot figure out the answer.

“What is important for personalisation is the ZPD where a student has enough support and incentive to become independent and make their own connections. Before that can happen, it is up to the teacher (or virtual teacher) to teach students to make connections by example or open questioning.”

Sure, you can interpret that comment differently, but I’m not so sure many of the EdTech companies actually do, especially in math. Too many of these companies seem to think that what constitutes math education is the ability to solve a problem so they come out with adaptive learning, hints, pre-testing, post-testing, alignment to common core, and anything else they can find to make the teacher as superfluous as possible.

France:The Tyranny of Mathematics by Sylvain Labeste

Of course the company line will always be, “Nothing is better than a real teacher”. When in the end what they are selling is the ability for a human being to supervise the work of 100 or more students at one time. Face it, the hard facts of education is that 70 to 85% of every school budget goes to teacher salaries.

Think about that for one second. Here let me help you, a school district near me just passed a bond to build a new school, $40,000,000, and still 80+% of their money goes to salaries.

Carl Schurz High School by Teemu008 (not this school)

If an edtech company wants to sell to a school they will do so by making it possible for teachers to do more work.

I’m getting off track, I don’t want to talk the money, but the money is one of the reasons for the tortured justification. the Zone of Proximal Development is not a motivation tool, it is a scaffolding tool. When questions are posed at just the right level students can, if they choose, figure out the answer and hopefully learn. Magic right? If enough of these questions are strung together eventually the student will progress up the ladder to knowledge.

Total poppycock, when a student is motivated he or she will work to answer the questions posed. If those questions are within the ZPD then the student will be able to work more independently and is less likely to give up. See, the motivation comes first.

Not only that but we can expand the ZPD of our students, but teaching them how to learn. Giving students tools and instructions for breaking down questions into manageable parts, teaching students skills for researching information, connecting with experts, etc… all can help make what was once an impossible question, into maybe we can figure this out.

Shooting the inspector by edrabbit

None of it however happens without the motivation. Motivation can be external like a basketball themed question, but it can also be internal. “Why do I hear the sound of fireworks a second after I see the flash?”

Teachers can sus out the educational value of the themed questions. This is a lot of work and requires a lot of creativity as well as subject knowledge. Technology can help, Open Educational Resources (OER) can be a way to crowdsource the knowledge of thousands of teachers.

Teachers can also encourage the internal drive of students. Instead of drilling procedures on children day after day quashing any and all questions. Teachers can slow down and encourage questions, “Hey, that sounds like something I would like to know. What is a good first questions to start researching?” or “I’ve got this questions and I hope you can help me design a solution?”


edited for clarity

Webmaker DeICE

I’m a bad webmaker because I didn’t put the event up, but in my defense it was just part of a small conference for educators. I like small conferences and DeICE (Dedicated Illinois Computing Educators) was a lot of fun, even for an introvert like me.

I led a session on Webmaking

My intention was to talk for 5 or 10 minutes and then let the audience create something together. I talked too long and, surprisingly enough, some of the educators didn’t have computers. What really happened is I spent most of the 45 minutes talking and answering questions.

As usual I tried to put too much information into my presentation; Webmaker tools, web literacies, badges, I did however focus myself long enough to spend the bulk of my time talking about thimble and explaining how to do an introductory lesson for elementary students.

chat with Comcast – not customer service that’s for sure

What they really need are time stamps so you can really see how long this takes.

    • CHAT ID: 2AA4DC90-57C9-4579-8FD1-D02E9330CBA8
    • Problem: I ordered a DVR and was told I would be charged an extra $10 per month and am being charged $20 a month and now I can’t get all the channels I used to get from my tv tuner card in my computer.
    • Archie > Hello LInda, Thank you for contacting Comcast Live Chat Support. My name is Archie. Please give me one moment to review your information.
    • LInda > My Issue: I ordered a DVR and was told I would be charged an extra $10 per month and am being charged $20 a month and now I can’t get all the channels I used to get from my tv tuner card in my computer.
    • Archie > I am here to provide you with excellent customer service today. Please be assured I will do my best to help you with your concern. How are you doing today?
    • LInda > fine
    • Archie > Great to know that.
    • Archie > Linda, I do understand you wanted to make sure you are correctly charged with your DVR.
    • Archie > I understand that you want to make sure that your billing charges are correct. I do apologize for the inconvenience that you need to contact us about your billing charges.
    • Archie > You have reached the right person, and I’ll ensure that we resolve your issue today.
    • LInda > First I would like to know why I am not getting all the channels I used to get on my tv tuner in my computer
    • Archie > Sure! We will definitely check on that.
    • Archie > May I know, what are those channels?
    • LInda > I only get two, wmaq and wvm or something like that
    • Archie > I will also check if those channels are part of your subscription.
    • Archie > As I checked it, WBM is not accessible with your area, however, WMAQ is on channel 5.
    • LInda > where are the rest of my channels I only get two
    • Archie > Oh, okay.
    • Archie > So you are only able to access two channels on your TV, right?
    • LInda > when I started paying for the new comcast dvr I stopped getting channels on my tv tuner in my computer.
    • Archie > Linda, with this concern, we will need to refresh the TV tuner by resetting the cable card.
    • Archie > Can you please pull out the card and plug it back in after 10 seconds.
    • LInda > what card
    • Archie > The one that is inserted to the TV tuner.
    • LInda > There is no card in the tv tuner there never was I didn’t need one before why should I need one now
    • Archie > Linda, I would like to inform you that this time, we will need to have the cable card so that we would be able to access the channels using your computer and Tv tuner.
    • LInda > what cable card are you talking about and why do I need one now that you have increased my bill by $20 a month
    • Archie > This is the device that will allow us to access the Digital channels to your computer using the TV tuner.
    • LInda > It doesn’t take a card it just plugs into the computer and the coax plugs into the tuner
    • Archie > Yes, however, if you will connect it with Comcast service, we will need to have the cable card for this.
    • Archie > I can assure that by adding the card, this issue will be resolved right away.
    • LInda > and how much extra will you charge for the card
    • LInda > and why didn’t I need a card before
    • Archie > Linda, I apologize that you are now affected by Comcast Digital Migration.
    • Archie > By the way, Digital Cable Migration (DTA or Project Cavalry) is a Comcast initiative to move all “Expanded Basic” cable networks to digital-only format. The migration will enable us to offer major enhancements to our services, including tons of HD channels, dramatically higher Internet speeds, more international channels, and better picture quality!
    • LInda > I should be able to view all clear qam channels
    • Archie > With this, we will need to add the cable card to your TV tuner for $ 2.
    • LInda > A few months ago I was watching all clear qam channels for no extra charge. Now I am paying $10 a month for a DVR and $10 extra for digital service (evne though was was on a digital package was was not told I would be charged and extra $10 a month) and now you want to charge me more. I want to go back to my old service.
    • Archie > I am very sorry to hear that.
    • Archie > Linda, if you would want to have the old service, we can definitely assist you with that by calling our department at 1-866-5654863.
    • Archie > Also, again, I personally apologize that you were not informed by these changes.
    • LInda > Why do I need to call to cancel services I don’t want? If a live chat was good enough to authorize extra charges on my account they should be good enough to remove those exact same services
    • Archie > Linda, I would like to set expectation that we are only able to assist you with the issues with your cable service.
    • Archie > We have other department which are designated for this concern and that is why we are referring you to them.
    • LInda > Your department was good enough to authorize extra charges your department is good enough to remove those exact same charges. I expect them to be removed immediately
    • Archie > As I told you we are only capable of assisting you with cable technical issues.
    • LInda > No you were able to authorize an additional charge on my account and send me a DVR you are thus authorized to cancel those same charges. If not then those charges were fraudulent. Which is it?.
    • Archie > Yes, we can but only for the devices and limited channels.
    • Archie > Linda, we apologize that we are unable to change or remove service package.
    • Archie > With this concern, we will need you to call the department.
    • LInda > You are doing nothing but making me angry
    • Archie > I am very sorry but I am just trying to tell you the truth, Linda.
    • LInda > YO are telling me company policy
    • LInda > you can discontinue services or someone can in your office and it should be done
    • Archie > We only able to assist you with technical issues with regards to your TV and I can assure that by calling the hotline, we would be able to assist you with getting back the service.
    • LInda > If I wanted to talk to someone on the phone I would have called. I prefer talking in chat. where is yoru supervisor?
    • Archie > Linda, we can definitely assist you with this.
    • Archie > We can also connect you with sales department if you want.
    • Archie > If we will connect you with the supervisor as well, you will undergo the same process.
    • LInda > If they will do as I want fine
    • Archie > Great!
    • Archie > I will definitely connect you with sales so that we would be able to assist you in getting back the old service.
    • Archie > Before I transfer your chat, do you have other concerns for me today? I will be glad to assist you further.
    • LInda > just transwfer me
    • Archie > Sure!
    • Archie > You will see a message that says I have “left the room”; however, you will still be connected to the department. Thank you! Please stay on this chat window while I connect you now.
    • Archie > Please wait, while the problem is escalated to another analyst
    • LInda > My Issue: I ordered a DVR and was told I would be charged an extra $10 per month and am being charged $20 a month and now I can’t get all the channels I used to get from my tv tuner card in my computer.
    • John > Welcome to Comcast Order Entry Department that support package deals on You can call me John. It’s my pleasure to assist you today. How are you doing today?
    • LInda > hello john I would like to revert my service to that which I had a few months ago, before getting a DVR from Comcast and being charged an extra $10 a month for digital services
    • John > Thank you so much for the information, Linda.
    • John > I understand that you want to get your old package. I will pull up your record and check this one for you.
    • John > I am pulling up your record on the system. Are you able to hold for 2 minutes?
    • LInda > yes
    • John > Thank you.
    • John > Do you have your account number?
    • LInda > 8771100380173029
    • John > Thank you so much.
    • John > As I pull up your account, I just want to share with you our Customer Gurantee. We are committed to providing our customers with a consistently superior customer experience. If for any reason something goes wrong, we will work to resolve the issue quickly and as professionally as we can. To know more about this, you may access this link,
    • John > Thank you for patiently waiting.
    • John > I just pulled up your record on the system.
    • John > I see here that you currently have Performance Internet and Limited Basic cable.
    • LInda > last time I chatted I thought it would be nice to get a dvr. I was told it would $10. This is what I got charged.
    • LInda > HD/DVR Service $8.0011/25 – 12/24 Service Discount ($3.05) Additional Outlet Svc $9.9511/25 – 12/24 HD Technology Fee $9.9511/25 – 12/24 Service Discount ($4.95) Total Additional XFINITY TV Services$19.90
    • LInda > So I would like to return it
    • John > You have the same package that you had before, it’s just that you are using your cable boxes to HD DVR.
    • John > Let me check your bill.
    • John > How many boxes do you have on your end?
    • LInda > I don’t have the same service as before because before I was watching TV on the TV tuner in my computer and now I can’t
    • LInda > I have a DVR and an analog box
    • John > Thanks for the information.
    • John > Let me explain the charge for the DVR and other box.
    • John > The charge for HD DVR is $19.95/month.
    • LInda > I was told it would $10
    • LInda > and I really don’t care, you have failed me in your services I would like to return to what I had before
    • John > That’s $10/month for the HD tech fee, this is need for the HD DVR to work, and $9.95/month for the box itself.
    • John > But the agent who added the hd dvr on your account gave a discount for the HD DVR.
    • John > Instead of $10, it has become $5/month for the HD tech fee.
    • LInda > and now my service is scrambled so undue the scramble and I will return the stupid box
    • John > Instead of $9.95, it has become $4.95/month for the hd dvr box.
    • John > On the bill, it is $19.90, it’s because you have an additional box.
    • John > Additional box costs $9.95/month each.
    • LInda > I don’t care what kind of excuses you have revert my service to what i had and I will return the HD DVR box
    • John > You can return the box in the nearest service center in your area or I can send you a return label so you can send it back to us.
    • John > Would you like me to send you a return label?
    • LInda > I will drop it off as soon as my sevice stops being scrambled
    • John > Supposedly HD DVR box is for for Starter package and higher HD packages. It may work with Limited basic cable but you may experience some issues as the equipment is way to higher to be paired with Limited basic.
    • John > Once you drop the box in the service center, they will be the one to remove the rate charge of that equipment.
    • LInda > so two hours ago you or Archie could have just said, return the box to the service center and we will remove the extra charges from the bill. but instead he tried to sell an extra card for my computer.
    • LInda > Let make sure I understand correctly.
    • LInda > I return the box to the cable center tomorrow. they remove all of these charges HD/DVR Service $8.0011/25 – 12/24 Service Discount ($3.05) Additional Outlet Svc $9.9511/25 – 12/24 HD Technology Fee $9.9511/25 – 12/24 Service Discount ($4.95) Total Additional XFINITY TV Services$19.90
    • LInda > When does the cable start working with my tv tuner again?
    • LInda > Why can’t you fix that right now
    • John > How many cable box are you going to return?
    • LInda > oned
    • LInda > I was not being charged to have one box before I shouldn’t suddenly start being charged for it now.
    • John > Currently you have two boxes, the HD DVR and the standard box. To get 0 charge for the equipment, limited basic cable package provides 3 free DTAs, this is kind of box designed for limited basic.
    • John > That standard box costs $9.95/mont for limited basic, thus, you need to swap it with DTA box.
    • John > It’s because you were just using dta box.
    • John > For the cable to start working with tv tuner, I would need to refer to our technical support for cable service, Ms. Kvidera. You are currently connected in Sales department.
    • LInda > Now what are you talking about? I’ve had the standard box for years since I first ordered cable and was never charged $10. I was told I could have two, but I only needed one so I don’t understand why I have to get something else now.
    • LInda > I was with the tech department, they tried to sell me an extra card. You have scrambled y TV signal so I can’t use it without the box you provide, you need to remove that scramble.
    • John > Is your second box, not the HD DVR box, the same box you’ve been using since you started with this service?
    • LInda > yes
    • John > If that is the case, all equipments charges for the cable service will be removed after you drop the box in the service center.
    • John > What is the make and model of that second box?
    • LInda > motorola messages
    • John > Is there a model number?
    • John > I need that information.
    • LInda > dct700/us
    • John > Thanks.
    • John > I checked the make and model of the box.
    • John > It’s a Digital Cable Box
    • John > Since it is a digital cable box, it needs to be swapped with a dta box to avoid charges on your cable equipments.
    • John > Do you have any other sales concern or question for me? I will be more than happy to answer your inquiry.
    • LInda > Back to the original theme of this stupid dialogue. How do I get the signal back to my tv tuner? No that you have completely alienated me as a customer by telling me the equipment you sent me and told me was free of charge now is going to be charged for.
    • John > For assistance on your signal issue, I really need to transfer to our technical department, we can process order here like upgrade, downgrade, and new orders.
    • LInda > good downgrade to what I had three months ago so the signal works again
    • John > There is no upgrade done on the services on your account except the equipments.
    • LInda > Then why is the signal scrambled?
    • John > It can be with equipments because HD DVR specs and features are not tailored for limited basic.
    • John > Limited basic should have either standard box or dta box.
    • John > I am not a technical support but that’s my suspicion since that the only change made on the account is the upgrade of equipment.
    • John > I am not a technical support but that’s my suspicion since that the only change made on the account, the upgrade of equipment.
    • LInda > I took the equipment off and reverted to my old computer with TV tuner and that no longer works
    • John > It would be a good idea if I will transfer you to our technical department so you would be assisted better.
    • John > Sales department can only process order, it’s the technical department who assist you further on your signal issue.
    • LInda > A few years ago I had internet only. I was told if I upgraded to internet and basic TV it would not cost any extra so I did and I was sent what you are are calling the standards box (I was told I could have two, but I only had one TV) Three months ago I ordered an HD DVR to go with the standard box. I was told this would cost $10. It is now costing me $20. I brought my computer back and reattached it to the tv and it no longer works. Now you are telling me I have to pay for the standard box that you sent me and told me was free and I cannot get a signal for the TV working.
    • John > If that second box was included on your original order for free, then you just need to return why the hd dvr. The reason why it costs now it because the HD DVR has become your primary equipment, and the second box is secondary or additonal. The bases for heirarchy of the equipment is the functionalities and specs of the device.
    • John > Let’s for example you have two boxes, a dta and standard box. Standard box has higher specs and functionalities compare to dta, thus standard box would be the primary and the dta would be become secondary or additional box.
    • John > Each package has its own package details in terms of equipments.
    • LInda > do you have access to the last chat I had with your company?
    • John > To get a Free HD DVR, you need to have a HD Triple play package.
    • John > I am sorry I dont’ have.
    • John > I can only view the transcript you had with Archie, the previous agent who assisted you before me.